Dark Prince: I’m with you on this. I rarely play espionage anymore because of just this point. Games of 300+ moves may be strategically perfect but so what, for most people this is on par with watching wallpaper dry. I’ve said it before but I think the game would be vastly improved if forward moves were not penalised by not being allowed to reverse the next move. It would make the game a lot faster without reducing the skill level.
The not making progress rule occurs quite often in chess tournaments where you often get down to having to complete you moves in 15 minutes and the player with more time just tries to run the clock down. I don’t think the rule is so applicable for correspondence chess or sites like Brainking.
Dark Prince: I think the part about multiple draw offers isn't appropriate. Yes it is annoying and yes it is bad manners but this can happen in any game on Brainking and I see no reason why Espionage should be treated differently. BK is no different to playing over the board, you politely decline the first time, do it more firmly the second time and then ignore them. They get the message. If it reaches a point where it is harrassment you can appeal to the arbitor (Fencer here).
Chaos: If the pieces move at the same speed the front piece is vacating the square at the same speed the new piece is entering it and the moves occur at the same time. For example take cars in a road, the car behind does not wait for the front car to have moved before it moves. It relies on the fact by going at the same speed the car will have vacated by the time it gets there.
Nothingness: I have never known the 50 move rule come into play personally in practise in chess although I have played over 1000 competitive games in leagues and tournaments. I've heard of it a couple of times in grandmaster play but that's it. The fact that such a rule is a problem in espionage illustrates why the game will always appeal to a small group of enthusiastic players rather than have popular appeal.
I think chess is a far richer game than espionage allowing a wider variety of styles. In chess the opening is often about the struggle to create a battlefield that accommodates you style, tactical, positional or strategic. In espionage if your goal is victory then allowing your opponent to take the Initiative and counter attacking is the safest course. This only leads to dull long drawn out games however. Such a style would be punished in chess by a player of a similar standard.
In over the board chess our county organises a tournament each year where you sign up the players get paired, arrange to play the game at their convenience with a time control like all moves in 2hrs and when all games are played you move to the next round. This is the only way I see emulating a real time tournament on brainking working. If people were prepared to play at weekends time zone differences could be worked round. You could not post a tournament and start it automatically so it would have to be organised via messages. I doubt there would be sufficient people who saw the hassle factor worth the benefit though. Failing that fisher with +8hrs stops mindlessly slow play but won't create an over the board type game.
Nothingness: 300 moves? That is probably why Dark Prince is correct in saying it does not have enough of a draw. Espionage needs a 20-20 version for mass appeal leaving the test match version to the aficionados.
Nothingness: The IYT time limit of 28 hours a move seems to work pretty well. I played a Jarmo tournament here with Fisher which added 8 hours per move which also worked well although when my opponent got down to 12 hours I did try using my time advasntage to move last thing at night hoping he had gone to bed. Not terrible sporting but as we are playing in an espionage tournament that has reached move 20 after 3 months I didn't have much sypmpathy!
My vote for a different version would be simply to allow a piece to move back to the square it came from. I think the attacker is always at a disadvantage in closed espionage, particularly the small version and this would eliminate this.
Subject: Re: Very good or better Espionage Players
I joined both sites the same time and after playing on them for a month chose Its Your Turn. Personally I think they are both good sites with different strengths and weaknesses. I like the fact you can see who is on line at BrainKing and I find the grading systems an interesting gimmick. I however prefer the way the tournaments work on Its Your Turn and, for me at least, is a more robust site with less crashes.
I don’t like the rule on Brainking’s Espionage that allows backward then forward but not the other way around. This seems to penalise positive play. I prefer Its Your Turn’s approach that you cant go back where you came from at all.
Little Golem is a great little site as well but limited games.
(hide) If you click on a person's name and then click Finished games you will have a list of games that have been completed, then click on the name of the game to get a summary of all of these games, then click on the name of the game again and you will have a game to view and analyze. (Servant) (show all tips)