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18. April 2009, 08:20:34
MrWCF 
Subject: Ratings
Can someone explain one aspect of ratings calculations to me?  How is an initial provisional rating calculated after four rated games have been completed? 

In the game of Cam, Jannssen has a provisional rating of 2100 after four victories, zero defeats, and zero draws.  Those four victories were against players with ratings of 1341, 1094, and unrated (2 of them).  How is a resultant rating of 2100 possible? 

Let me hasten to add that this is not to cast aspersions on Jannssen's Cam skill level.  For all I know, he is a world-class Cam player.

18. April 2009, 12:18:29
Undertaker. 
Subject: Re: Ratings
MrWCF: Welcome to BrainKing my friend.

I disagree with this rating calculation, because is very unfair. In Plakoto happened me the same thing. I did 4 games against players
with weak BKR and now i have 4 games, 4 victories and 2457 points. For me, a player with 4 games cannot be in first place.
This way is very easy to be in first places without big troubles. This isn't my idea about competition. For me, to be the first is need play many games and beat the best players and this don't happen here.

18. April 2009, 12:21:01
Fencer 
Subject: Re: Ratings
Undertaker.: Provisional ratings are VERY inaccurate and should not be taken too seriously. Established ratings should be always used to compare skills of players.

18. April 2009, 12:30:41
Undertaker. 
Subject: Re: Ratings
Fencer: I know, but in this situation will be more easy for a player manage his rating, playing only with weak players and maintaining a high rating. On the other hand, a player with 2 defeats in first 6 games, for example, will have big difficulties to ascend quickly in same rating.

18. April 2009, 12:31:16
joshi tm 
Subject: Re: Ratings
Fencer: I think 25 played games is still a bit low to predict a player's play rating. So why not make another rating level for played 100 rated games (ehm, well-established BKR)

18. April 2009, 12:44:40
Undertaker. 
Subject: Re: Ratings
Modified by Undertaker. (18. April 2009, 12:46:19)
joshi tm: I think that isn't the point. For me, everybody must start each game rating with 1000 or 1200 points and each victory give between 10 and 50 points, in accordance with BKR opponent. For me would be the more correct rating calculation and would be necessary play many games and play against best players to be in the top.
Besides, it doesn't must be very difficult to do it (the new rating calculation, of course).

18. April 2009, 18:03:38
MrWCF 
Subject: Re: Ratings
Modified by MrWCF (18. April 2009, 18:05:40)
Fencer:Yes, I realize that provisional ratings are very inaccurate.  What I was asking is how they are calculated.  In the example that I posted, a player received a provisional rating of 2100 after four victories, zero defeats, and zero draws.  Those four victories were against players with ratings of 1341, 1094, and unrated (2 of them).  How was his resultant rating of 2100 calculated?

18. April 2009, 18:07:12
Pedro Martínez 
Subject: Re: Ratings
MrWCF: As far as I know, BK uses the following formulas:
http://math.bu.edu/people/mg/ratings/approx/approx.html

18. April 2009, 20:25:52
Constellation36 
Subject: Re: Ratings
MrWCF: Let me hasten to add that this is not to cast aspersions on Jannssen's Cam skill level. For all I know, he is a world-class Cam player.

Is there any such thing as a world class player in Cam? Heh, i don't even know what Cam is, lol. :-)

BTW as per what Pedro Martinez says about your Embassy Chess skills(although seeing some of your games i saw some unwise moves) do you mind playing some fast paced games with me?
This site is great but most top players are unwilling to play and reject my invitations as they have to play some hundreds of games and have no time for more. :-(

18. April 2009, 23:29:17
MrWCF 
Subject: Re: Ratings
Constellation36:

BTW as per what Pedro Martinez says about your Embassy Chess skills(although seeing some of your games i saw some unwise moves<img>) do you mind playing some fast paced games with me?

This site is great but most top players are unwilling to play and
reject my invitations as they have to play some hundreds of games and
have no time for more. :-(


I would love to!!!
Additionally, I would really like to hear about my specific unwise moves--I'm still trying to learn more about Embassy Chess, especially about deciding whether castling is wise in this variant.  Also, I can't seem to get the piece values in relation to each other straight--I'm still hung up on the 1-3-3.25-5-9 values in traditional chess.  Walter Montego and I have had a couple of discussions related to castling and piece values in Embassy Chess, but I'm still hoping for more information.


18. April 2009, 23:42:33
Constellation36 
Subject: Re: Ratings
MrWCF: Wow!!!
I guess wow means what a great rating system this is?

Also, I can't seem to get the piece values in relation to each other straight--I'm still hung up on the 1-3-3.25-5-9 values in traditional chess.
I can't give you information of this kind with values etc. I can get my son speak about these things for hours, but i don't think that way in Chess and in Embassy Chess. It's just an experience matter and just think that way only.

I can give you countless general as also of specific type examples, of e.g Cardinal is better than Marshall here and there. And that of course with the small experience i got by playing this game here. In Chess is another matter and i have great experience being an IM. My beliefs about piece values-relations of this game have sounded a bit odd when i told them to another strong player, panzerschiff, but i think i'm right to all my conclusions. :-)
But this conversation is not for here but only to the appropriate discussion board i guess.

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