Seems like you could add a variable to change the ratio based on how many people sign up too.
x = starting amount
b = bonus amount
n = number of players entered
c = constant to divide the number of players

1) First pond:

c = b X n ÷ x
c = 500 X 249 ÷ 20000
c = 6.225

2) Czuch's 19000 first bid pond, makes x = 1000
Note there's also less players in this game, but the bonus is the same.

c = 500 X 16 ÷ 1000
c = 8.000

If this has any correlation to how the game is played, then what Czuch has done (by design or not), is modify the original Pond game to make a smaller version that should play near the same. Though the bonus is going to figure hugely in the game from the start as it is now slightly more than ½ the amount of points the leaders have.
It seems to me that the most important variable of the game is the amount of players in relation to the ratio of bonus to starting amount. It'll be interesting to see how these two games play out. I'm in them both and will see first hand. Of course the various people involved and what happens along the way will make the game what it is.
Perhaps the game's starting point could be based on the number of players signed up using a constant of the game creator's chosing. I kind of like the table Bry and BigBadWolf have thought up. It'd be easy to look at the table and pick the values that one would like. As we get more experience playing this game, we should be able to make choices the will give us the kind of game we would like to play. A slow calculating game or a fast gambling game. Use of a table along with a variable for the number of players and you could have it set how you want and not need to bother with capping the amount of players except to limit the number of days a game will take to play.

MidnightMcMedic:

If this is yelling ((( According to the "TITLE" and "DESCRIPTION" of the pond, Its for "JUNGLE WARRIORS" fellowship only.
Please remove yourself from the pond.

TY

http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=44&trnst=0)))

Then I would like to know what you think is nice.

LOL

Before anyone else gets yelled at, please be sure and read the entire description before joining a run. Some are starting runs for fellowships only and if you're not a part of those fellowships, you will get a message tell you to leave.

only twice, I'm getting dizzy from falling in so much

You too BBW? Thought I was out there swimming alone LOL

pushed ay, it was an accidental sneeze, with a sudden gust of wind, i wasnt pushing you in you or anything.

Splash! You fell in the pond.

Ugh! I leave the site for a few hours, and I get pushed into the water.... TWICE! (Yes, I did not fall - I was pushed!)

I think a lot of people were frustrated with the slow pace of the first pond run, and we were "searching" for some way to make this game interesting quicker than the current pace of that game. I think that if the ratio is lower than 40 to 1, which it is currently, it makes the game get 'interesting' much sooner.

I think another way to 'solve' this issue is to allow us to create games with fewer people, so those of us that want, can play more "end games", say start with 6 players, then it would be exciting from the very first move!!

what are we solving for here? I doubt the subtle difference in amounts will mean a significant change in approach. And firthermore how would you know until you've at least finished one game?

I think how Bry explained it would be best.

Starting point Value: Choose between 1,000 - 20,000 (Maybe choices like 1,000, 2,500, 5,000, 7,500, 10,000, 12,500, 15,000, 17,500, 20,000)

Bonus Points: Choice between 0 = 500 (maybe choices like 0, 50, 100, 150, 200, 250, 300, 350, 400, 450, 500)

So the most "unbalanced" game would be start with 1,000 points, and can get up to 500 bonus points - which is how many games will be towards the end of the game anyway!

Yes something like that bry....

The way Fencer has described it, nothing will be changed at all from the way it currently is. The reason we want the ability to make our own parameters, is to change the ratio, or percentage between the starting point and the bonus pooihnts. That is the whole idea.

That is why keeping the 500 point bonus at all times, and just letting us continue to create games that have a minimum first bid to change the ratio ourselves , is prefered over having a forced 40 to 1 ratio

Fencer - if the starting points and bonus are not to become unbalanced, could the option for starting points be a drop down menu where you can only select - for example - 1,000, 2,000, 3,000 up to 20,000, and once you have selected this figure - the option for bonus points is dependent on your starting figure.

For example, if you chose 20,000 starting, the maximum bonus is 500. If you chose 10,000 starting, the maximum bonus you can chose would be 250 and so on.?

Fencer: The bonus.

Thad: I don;'t follow you. What should be minimum of zero?

Fencer: There should be SOME variation allowed! Maybe minimum of zero (yes, this should be allowed!!) and max of x/number of players in pond.

There was an idea to have an option to set the starting points and the bonus value during the pond definition.
Anyway, it should be assured that no future pond game becomes unbalanced because of badly chosen parameters (e.g. starting with 50 points and bonus 5000). That's why this proposal has been created:

x = starting points (multiple of 40)
x/40 = bonus

The current parameters (20000, 500) follow this rule as well.

Mely: Sounds interesting :-)

rabbitoid: LOL...we shall see, but they will only do it once, I guarantee that!

Mely: Not bad.. :-)

Dear fencer, dear pondsplayer. I have a new idea for ponds (named antiponds).
The basic rules are the same. But one reduction. The first bid is without reservation. But the next moves have this cut: you can only bid equal or less then your previos move.
Bonus is not given.
So the first bid is very important. If you bid 1.000 points or less, you fall fast in the pond, because you are must give the lowest bid.
If you bid 10.000 points, you stay longer, but soon you have not points left.
I find, this can be a very tricky game.
Dear Fencer, what do you think about one test game ?

Czuch Chuckers: any side bet on how many will forget your rule and bet the usual 7?

i NEED 2 MORE TO START A 19000 FIRST BID GAME FOR 16 PEOPLE

Walter Montego: Duration till next move

;oÞ

You wait for the next round in 1 pond
You are waiting for the next round in 1 pond
You are waiting for the next round in 2 ponds

Least ways that looks like gooder English to me. :)

OH, its 1s and 0s, right?

Bad Bishop: Great joke, BB!

Is binary in 10s?

LOL, guess you know into what group I fall :)

LOL even drunk i understand that LOL

According the types of people and strong offtopic: I like "There are 10 types of people: those who understand binary and those who don't." :-)

Betting low is understandable, even a small advantage near the end could be decisive. Of course it is risky as well.

I still don't understand people betting 1800 in the first pond. Clearly 11 would stay alive for instance in this case. The best you can hope for with a bet of 1800 is net 1300.

Oh well, as they say there are 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those who can't

kitti: Thats what makes every game so unique... BBW just bet a 502 in the first round and got the bonus and is in first place! The dynamics will always be in flux. Soon someone will get burned in the first round with a quite high bet and people will start to bet a lot higher on the first round....MAYBE!

I'm quite surprised how low people are going on the smaller ponds in the first rounds. I guess the first one with loads of players has had quite an influence on everyones minds :)

Muhehe :]

Don't forget to bid for the second round. :-)

Only 1 player did not bid the min in the 19000 min pond game, and that was Rose - Luckly just the one so they fell into the lake!

One with 19400 got 500 bonus, so it sitting really well now.

http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=28 - Bry's 19000 min first bid tournament.

Fencer - can you take that to the BK.com board please... off topic... LOL.

The main reason was the BKR and history regeneration.

I guess it was part of the site down just a little earlier

Heh :-)

Fencer - great work on the "signed up" and message when fall in" changes.

cool we get a message when wqe fall in LOL

Fencer: Cool I realised nothing would show yet...
But how will it work?

How would you make it , there is big difference in run where are 16 players and difference in totally first run where is about two hundred players . Victory in first run will have bigger value then 16 players run .

Stevie: Yes but there is nothing to rate until at least one pond is finished.

was there a rating system set up for pond yet?

Heh :-)

beautiful job, putting the ponds on the main page. thank you, Fencer! :)

Hopefully Fencer will sort it. I'd rather it say inside the page which ones you have signed up for as you wont need to look thru them all. Even if that number said 2, I'd still have to trawl thru them all to see whoch one or two I havent signed for....

yes i just tried it , signed up for another , but still says 15

no mate - there's 15 pond games there. I went thru them all and I had already signed up for 12 of them, one i couldnt as it had reached 16 players max and 2 were new ones i have now signed up for.