(V): well thats good, and at least for a change you don't

Bernice: Certain philosophies would disagree with you on that.

I'll say goodnight.. no-one wants to answer to "what happens to the millions of little people"!!

(V): I probably should have said "has a leaning towards"
as was said below by someone....everyone leans towards something, you can't be "nothing"

(V): No this thread started with your responding to

gogul: want the big fishes to starve so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so much. Well high politics, justice and the big corporations, soon as it implodes this will be a real relief for the people.

by the way I want a ford because the wheel base suits me but I don't want a ford engine, who do I contact to sue

Bernice: Nope.... political systems by their nature don't work. As someone said, democracy is just the best system so far!!

Vikings: I didn't want an apple, I wanted a PC... but with apple is the OS bundled?

No.... we were discussing today the little people.

I would say that Jules would be of the LABOUR persuasion........

(V): no body forced you to buy it, you could have bought an apple if you didn't want it.
The subject originally was big business going bankrupt and it evolved into trickle down economics

Artful Dodger: Wrong. I am not liberal. I will not repeat myself again!!

Vikings: It came with the machine, I had no option not to purchase the machine without windows as most do not.

Anyway... the subject was the little people, part of the big businesses. Or the little people, those who invest their life savings in what everyone says is a safe bet. It's not their fault a big business makes a mess of things, so why should all those normal, everyday people loose out? Why should they loose everything they spent a life building??

I've seen no-one here come up with an answer to that, just diversion and changing subjects.

(V):  It doesn't have to be accurate.  But in general, it's safe to say that you lean on the liberal side of politics and on moral authority.  My leanings are much more conservative. 

Artful Dodger: And being loose it is never accurate. period.

(V): judges are 1/3 of the government acting like 1/2 of the government.
who forced you to buy it?

(V):  Yes.  Even you fit into a slot of some kind.  It's what defines you and your way of viewing the world.  Not necessarily a rigid definition, but a definition nonetheless.  I'm a conservative thinker.  That ought to give you some idea of my political leanings and view of life.  Not every detail, but to some degree.   Some attitudes are definitely characteristic of the left, some of  the right.  Some fall in the middle.  

Vikings: we were talking about government, not judges....

Windows is not IE!! You'll agree 99%+ PC's (I allow for error) are sold with windows installed.. even the cashpoints and shop tills use windows.

Artful Dodger: WE are all God. Everything IS God.

"We all fit into some slot with respect to our political views and with respect to our philosophy of life."

Ohhhhhhh no we don't!!

(V): First of all it was judges that took his money, they weren't elected so there was no change in subject,

secondly Gates made a consumer product people voluntarily purchased it, then the government took his money because people are too lazy to download firefox. or buy apple
He stole from nobody, nobody had to buy from him

(V): Well, you're not God so that comparison is weak.   And a liberal IS a category.  We all fit into some slot with respect to our political views and with respect to our philosophy of life. 

There's a difference between a category and stereotyping.   Nothing wrong with identifying categories. 

Artful Dodger: I find categorising people never works. It's like trying to describe God with words.... how do you describe something that IS???

Vikings: I can disagree with policy without saying someone is stealing.

And Gates was stolen from... yet over here we find in respect he's been stealing (to use your phrase) though in broad daylight from consumers!!

And btw... I was talking not about judges, why change the subject?

(V):  it's not a stereotype, it's a category. 

Czuch: I'm a human being, not a liberal. It would help if you remember that. As I said stereotyping me as a liberal will not work.

Do I have to repeat myself on that??

and by the way Judges are not elected into office only out in smaller jurisdictions

(V): Being elected has nothing to do with doing the right thing, unless you now have to agree with everything Bush did since he was elected, Gates was stolen from by the U.S. government and individual states governments

Czuch:  Good piint!

(V): your last post... it has nothing in it about trickle down economics?

All i know, is that every liberal I ever talk to, will tell me that trickle down economics doesnt work, when I argue that you cant keep taking from the big dogs because without the big dogs there are no little dogs... but now, for some odd reason, it is the liberals telling us how we have to keep the big dogs alive because the little dogs rely on them???

Czuch: You liberal types...... stereotyping..... read my last post

(V): Funny thing is that it is you liberal types who say you dont believe in trickle down economics, except when it is turned upside down... I mean really???? You want to take from the rich to give to the poor, and then when the rich start to fail, then you want to bail them out

Czuch: If it was one related business.. but it never is. That point you keep missing.

Czuch: No I'm not. And as for greater heights then ever imagined.....

Sorry, the sci-fi writers imagined it way before it happened, and in retrospect... No country has beaten the power of the former British Empire and is unlikely due to our belief in democracy ever will.

"The lack of hope was obviously not devastating...."

At the time it was. And that devastation despite arguments about policies back then is agreed by all.

(V): You think it's all about big people and forget the little people who big business is reliant on


Again, you are wrong... I didnt forget about all those people, that just the way life goes sometimes. There might be a factory so I decide to build a hot dog stand to take advantage of their lunch breaks.... its all good, but I shouldnt get some government guarantee that this factory never goes out of business, just to protect my small venture?

(V): That lack of hope (everyone who disagrees about the cause and effect and cure) all agree was devastating.


Again, you assume too much and miss the whole point

The lack of hope was obviously not devastating, since we recovered and grew to even greater heights than ever imagined!

Vikings: SOME PEOPLE want them to fail, not everyone. In some businesses (which some people can't see) is the damage that uncontrolled failure can cause. One of the things everyone can agree regarding the great depression was the lack of hope that some people think is acceptable today! That lack of hope (everyone who disagrees about the cause and effect and cure) all agree was devastating.

"without further stealing from the working people of their hard earned money, Bill Gates has already been stolen from"

... Stealing?? Are not our government's elected? Through democracy!! We are not talking expenses here of MP's, but policy.

As for Bill stealing... we all know if we buy a PC we are buying windows, but the EU (government) has outlawed Bill's monopoly, yet you don't want this government and would allow Bill and the likes of Intel to cheat the market and us of 'free competition'??

What do you want?

Czuch: And of Ethel who worked behind the till in the local Branch in 'X'? Or Mrs Jones the cleaner? What about Miss Peabody who works in the cafe reliant on car workers for 75% of it's trade??

You think it's all about big people and forget the little people who big business is reliant on and as such are not at fault for big businesses going under.... they are just working for a living!!

Pink Floyd's Final Cut first track comes to mind.

(V): You are missing the point, altho it wasn't stated, If Bill Gates prospers, good for him, he did it in the free market, what companies people want to starve so so so so much (and it isn't that people want but rather know will happen) are the ones that the government has interfered and supplemented like the car companies and the large banks, those are already socialized and cannot make it as such without further stealing from the working people of their hard earned money, Bill Gates has already been stolen from

(V): Sounds socialist even communist in regard to reasons for communist/socialist states. But such is that such an attitude is against your free market model you idolise. No more Bill Gates, no more multi-internationals ruling the market.....


Not really.... I am not against the free market at all.... it is the free market that would let failing companies fail, if Bill gates cant make it, well then too bad for him. But I dont want to force him to make less, or "force" him to stay in business (make it) with government. Thats what socialism does... it puts government supported limits on the highs and the lows, which most liberals subscribe to, they just want everyone to be middle class, they dont like to see anyone fail, and they will take from those who succeed to keep that from happening!

I am not saying that is all bad.... and mostly their hearts are in the right place, I just believe that in the long run, that is not the model i would want us to subscribe to... I believe it makes us all too homogeneous, too generic, and that is not good for growth and productivity and creativity... it creates laziness and complacency and in the end a blah, ordinary, and completely mundane country

Czuch: The great depression and the NRA have little relation to current events. The depression back then was affected by the Gold Standard being behind currency evaluation. There was a universal lack of confidence back then, something we don't have now, and that since the great depression we've had systems in place to take care of those directly affected instead of 'soup kitchens'.... Also there is no 'dustbowl'. A lesson in agriculture that will never be repeated.

The NRA is not the same within reasonable comparison, as your current admin's policies have some significant differences which make the recovery program similar but different.

"want the big fishes to starve so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so much....."

Sounds socialist even communist in regard to reasons for communist/socialist states. But such is that such an attitude is against your free market model you idolise. No more Bill Gates, no more multi-internationals ruling the market..... If you think it through then in the long term to prevent re-occurrences then a cap on how much you can earn would have to be set.

.... More government, more interference but possibly (according to the likes of Karl Marx) would make the occurrence of depression/recession cycles (as they are natural to the free market) further apart, which in some respects lead to more unpredictability, leading to less risk taking.....

Businesses and people would just have to be more sensible, less risk taking naturally but at a cost of a less free market and codes of ethics being set which all significant businesses would have to live by.

.... A socialist free market.

Czuch: Yes, the big fishes and welfare abusers are the same, undeserved priviledges.

gogul: want the big fishes to starve so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so much. Well high politics, justice and the big corporations, soon as it implodes this will be a real relief for the people (maybe not every single individual, but who cares, lazy times will be over then, GREAT!)

Übergeek 바둑이: The solution is let companies fail and let the economy take the hit and start over.



Whats wrong with that idea??? Many economists believe we would have come out of the great depression faster and stronger had we simply done that, and my opinion is that is what we should have done this time as well

Übergeek 바둑이: The solution is let companies fail and let the economy take the hit and start over. Saving banks, car companies and monopolies wil not help working class people or small businesses, and it is from those segments of the economy that the recovery will come in the end.

Yes, I agree to that. For banks, the sentence "too big to fail" comes from people who are trying to protect their undeserved priviledges. To me it seems too obvious that the companies known for having cheated their balance and customers for years have to get cut off of the system, it would allow fair companies to take over the businesses. Problem seems to be that the justice isn't independent if it comes to the big fishes. I want the big fishes to starve so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so so much. Well high politics, justice and the big corporations, soon as it implodes this will be a real relief for the people (maybe not every single individual, but who cares, lazy times will be over then, GREAT!)

Tuesday:  I see dead people.. EEEewwwwwWW

Tuesday: That or they've got some kinda of stasis.

Tuesday: Stalin I think had a bigger memorial... I'm not sure about other leaders of Russia, or as it became the USSR.

You can find it by doing a search by the bill number, SB-2099. http://ron.dotson.net/guns/sb2099.htm

As it is stated on the top of the board CURRENT NEWS and politics, therefore as much as I am bored with this topic, it is a valid one.

Please keep all baggage from the flame fellowships off of this board,