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13. Gennaio 2013, 17:01:45
Mort 
Argomento: Re: I'm talking specifically about what it says in the book of Genesis.
Iamon lyme: The symbol of a serpent or snake played important roles in religious and cultural life of ancient Egypt, Canaan, Mesopotamia, and Greece. The serpent was a symbol of evil power and chaos from the underworld as well as a symbol of fertility, life, and healing.[2] Nahash, Hebrew for "snake", is also associated with divination, including the verb-form meaning to practice divination or fortune-telling. In the Hebrew Bible, Nahash occurs in the Torah to identify the serpent in Eden.....

....The Hebrew word nahash is used to identify the creature that appears in Genesis 3, in the Garden of Eden. God placed Adam in the Garden to tend it (Genesis 2:15), but he has warned both Adam and Eve not to eat the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, "or you will die". (Genesis 3:3, NIV) The serpent tells Eve that this is untrue, and that if she and the man eat the fruit they will have knowledge and will not die. So Adam and Eve eat the fruit, but the knowledge they gain is loss of childlike innocence, and they are banished from the Garden. The Snake is punished for its role in their fall by being made to crawl on its belly in the dust, from where it continues to bite the heel of man. According to the Rabbinical tradition, the serpent represents sexual desire.[1][3]

The serpent of Genesis plays the role of trickster, a speaking animal which even shares knowledge with God which is hidden from man. As with other trickster-figures, the gift it brings is double-edged: Adam and Eve gain knowledge, but lose Eden. The choice of a venomous snake for this role seems to arise from Near Eastern traditions associating snakes with danger and death, magic and secret knowledge, rejuvenation, immortality, and sexuality. It is also possible that the association of the snake with the nude goddess in Canaanite iconography lies behind the scene in the Garden between the reptile and naked Eve, "Mother of all life",[4] the "Great Mother Goddess of the Canaanites"[5] Qetesh.

Debate about the Serpent in Eden is whether it should be viewed figuratively or as a literal animal. Voltaire, drawing on Socinian influences, wrote: "It was so decidedly a real serpent, that all its species, which had before walked on their feet, were condemned to crawl on their bellies. No serpent, no animal of any kind, is called Satan, or Belzebub, or Devil, in the Pentateuch."[6]

"So yeah, there's all sorts of contradictions and inconsistencies and impossibilities... if that's what you WANT to see."

Maybe not if you allow for the heritage of our ancestors that was oral history. It's still used by the aborigines to teach how to survive in the bush.

btw.... I was as well talking about Genesis, but remembering certain proverbs passages stating this a wise creation.

13. Gennaio 2013, 21:29:28
Iamon lyme 
Argomento: Re: I'm talking specifically about what it says in the book of Genesis.
(V): "The Snake is punished for its role in their fall by being made to crawl on its belly in the dust, from where it continues to bite the heel of man. According to the Rabbinical tradition, the serpent represents sexual desire.[1][3]"


How does Rabbinical tradition interpret mans punishment of working the ground and eating by the sweat of his brow, and womans increased travail in childbirth? If not literal, then what do those represent? What are the guidlines for determining what may be interpreted literally or not? If the story of Noah had to be symbolic until our knowledge of DNA and natural selection "made" it possible for that to be a real event, am I to assume reality itself is dependent on what I am able to understand? If you reduce the entire story of creation (and the fall) to being figurative, then the serpents involvement and what happened to him CAN be reduced to the serpent representing sexual desire. So now, if the serpents roll in all of this has been reduced to biting heels, I can now interpret that to mean all sexual desires are limited to foot fetishes... in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.

15. Gennaio 2013, 19:10:16
Mort 
Argomento: Re: in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.
Iamon lyme: ............... You understand now why there have been so many fake end of the worlds predicted.

One passage I was taught is the core of it all.

15. Gennaio 2013, 22:25:28
Iamon lyme 
Argomento: Re: in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.
(V): "You understand now why there have been so many fake end of the worlds predicted."

I'm not aware of anyone who believed the Mayan calendar running out meant the end of the world. I'm aware of people implying there were people who believed it, but I would have to take that on faith as I haven't heard of or from anyone who actually believed it. I'm sure some people believed it because they heard skeptics talking about it, but I'm inclined to believe that story started with the skeptics. However, if as you say there have been many 'fake' end of the world predictions, doesn't that imply the existence of a 'genuine' prediction? If you believe the world will come to an end, then perhaps you could enlighten us with a genuine prediction. Or are you talking about something else?

15. Gennaio 2013, 23:25:42
Mort 
Argomento: Re: in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.
Iamon lyme: All sorts.. From Christian preachers making a mint on predicting the second coming to people believing we are about to be hit by a rogue planet.... ... That months/years before it'd been easy to see unaided such a rogue planet is of no matter to their belief.

.. I worked for one company years back who were hired to check that computers their contractors used not going to have a logic hiccup through not enough date storage bits... One guy working at the company believed that even toasters were going to be affected by this ""Y2K"" problem.

..... Still some people believe the world is flat..... Mind is a powerful device that can get hard wired as well as software errors that create false reality.

This is an old known problem.

As to the world ending.... About 6 billion years or more when the sun goes into it's red giant stage as the star starts to die.

16. Gennaio 2013, 01:05:45
Iamon lyme 
Argomento: Re: in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.
(V): Please explain to me how any prediction can be a 'fake'. If you predict the outcome of a horse race, is the prediction a 'fake' if the outcome is not as you predicted?

16. Gennaio 2013, 02:14:49
Iamon lyme 
Argomento: Re: in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.
(V): ".. I worked for one company years back who were hired to check that computers their contractors used not going to have a logic hiccup through not enough date storage bits... One guy working at the company believed that even toasters were going to be affected by this ""Y2K"" problem."

It's my understanding the Y2K problem was fixed with plenty of time left over before the year 2000 arrived. Oh well, at least it was fun to speculate over what could have happened, and maybe gin up some fear over it. And it could have been worse than anyone anticipated... if it caused clocks to stop working altogether, even analogs like the wind up grandfather clocks, then maybe time itself would have stood still. We will never know, because all those clocks kept on working and moving time along.

17. Gennaio 2013, 00:03:40
Iamon lyme 
Argomento: Re: in other words, as long as I'm able to divorce anything from reality I don't want linked with reality, I'm free to interpret anything to mean what I want it to mean.
(V): "As to the world ending.... About 6 billion years or more when the sun goes into it's red giant stage as the star starts to die"

6 billion? That doesn't give us much time. I've heard it could keep going for another 10 billion years before it starts winding down. But regardless of how long it takes, that little tidbit about the sun is all I needed (on top of what you've already said) for me to understand what or who you believe God is.

17. Gennaio 2013, 01:22:26
Mrs Moon 
Argomento: Re: that little tidbit about the sun is all I needed (on top of what you've already said) for me to understand what or who you believe God is.
Iamon lyme: Who do you believe what God is??

17. Gennaio 2013, 01:31:20
Iamon lyme 
Argomento: Re: that little tidbit about the sun is all I needed (on top of what you've already said) for me to understand what or who you believe God is.
Silvery Moon: I've moved on to another topic.

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