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<< < 1 2 > >> 20. февруари 2009, 16:56:24 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" The Usurper: Power is just one aspect... we rank quite high in many other aspects as well... but if I were so ashamed of my country as you are, and if i thought the government was such a conspirator against the good of the people, as you do, and I knew of other countries that had a better government and a better life, then I would simply go there, why not? Why do so many want to come here to the US, if we are so bad???? Why not just go to Denmark, or the UK? 21. февруари 2009, 01:50:37 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: Believe me, if I could afford it, I'd move. You want to donate something to me out of the goodness of your charitable heart? lol 21. февруари 2009, 04:27:25 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" The Usurper: If you would promice to move out of this country, I would send you my life savings... 20. февруари 2009, 18:04:45 Относно: There is not one person in the US denied health care, this even applies to those in this country who arent even citizens!  Czuch: This is the crux of it. All the web sites in the world don't change the fact that health care in the US is accessible to everyone. Parents who neglect their children are at fault for their poor health condiditons. 20. февруари 2009, 20:43:56 Относно: Re: Parents who neglect their children are at fault for their poor health condiditons. Artful Dodger: In every case? It's the parents fault??? And btw... We can get to be seen straight away. GP's are same day service or bookable in certain cases, 24/7 GP service, A&E work fine. And each case is treated individually as per the patients need. I phoned the doc once, described what the problem was and got an ambulance in less then 5 minutes. Tests were done within the hour and the results processed and returned within another hour. Please.... Don't believe all you here on the net about the NHS, it's not all true.  20. февруари 2009, 20:52:53 Относно: Re: Parents who neglect their children are at fault for their poor health condiditons. (V): Parents are responsible for the health and safety of their children. Simple things like eating right, healthy living, brushing teeth, taking vitimans, and staying informed. Most "poor" households have more than one TV. They likely have cable too. They have "stuff." People can be lazy and neglect health concerns until something is wrong. Then they complain that the government isn't doing enough for them. Well, they ought to have been doing things for themselves all along. I see kids with rotting teeth and can't help but wonder how young children can get that way. It's proper diet and proper care. Prevention. Don't have kids if you don't know how to care for them. People need to be expected to be responsible. If the government offers universal health care, then I vote for full government intrusion and let's have the government also hold folks accountable for healthy living. Are you over weight? The government ought to be able to force you into losing weight. Do you smoke? If so, you either quit or lose any coverage. People should have to submit their meal plans so the State knows that they are doing their best to keep the kids healthy. I wonder how long that would go over? No. People want to be irresponsible and then they want the government to step in and fix things for them. Let's have 14 kids with no job, no husband, and no life, and then expect the government to fork over the millions it will cost to care for those kids. Yeah, that's a good idea. No personal responsibility. 20. февруари 2009, 21:28:13 Относно: Re: Parents who neglect their children are at fault for their poor health condiditons. Artful Dodger: Aye... But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. It's like the abuse thing, an abuser is someone who's been abused in some way that happens to be the one in eight. And so on.... I believe you have a problem in America in some areas of proper sex education. Are you saying the victims of such a void should be punished? 20. февруари 2009, 22:42:18 Относно: Re: Parents who neglect their children are at fault for their poor health condiditons. (V):I think maybe the UK has a certain issue with sex education, seen the recent headlines in the tabloids?? 20. февруари 2009, 22:59:22 Относно: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. (V): They are not being punished. It's a logical consequence. If you put your hand on a hot stove, you will get your hand burnt. No use in saying that it's not your fault as you didn't know better (bad upbringing). If you don't have the skills to properly parent, then don't have kids. If you want kids, learn how it's done. Take classes. Get informed. But don't offer me excuses. You do something bad, it's YOUR fault. Not your mom. Not your dad. Own up. 20. февруари 2009, 23:19:02 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. Artful Dodger: A logical consequence? Many who've read the books still can turn out not to have the skills to be a parent. "your fault..." No, not in all cases. Making such a general statement is neither accurate or wise. If the education is not available or made available, then it is not their fault. If the soul has been so damaged or through genetic disorders.. is it their fault? ... So many factors. 21. февруари 2009, 01:23:09 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. (V):excuses, excuses, excuses 21. февруари 2009, 01:29:58 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. Artful Dodger: I agree... the bottom line is that a child is the responsibility of the parents.... and sure, there are rare exceptions, just like everything, but the facts remain, children are the responsibility of their parents, and if you arent ready to accept that full responsibility, then DONT HAVE ANY CHILDREN!!!! 21. февруари 2009, 01:45:58 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. Czuch Exactly! And they can cut the excuse making. I'm not buying any of that nonsense. The problem with liberal philosophy is that they refuse to place the blame where it belongs. I have an idea for a national health care program. If it were to go through, you have to qualify. No fat people. If you're overweight, lose the weight or your on your own. If you smoke, quit or your on your own. If your kids are fat, get them to a gym or they are not covered. If you drink too much, and have any drinking related problems, you're on your own. I'd make a list like this and people would have to qualify for coverage. Not only that, but I'd force everyone to join a gym and they'd have to check in each week via a scanner. I'd 1984 the people to the max. And anyone wanting a kid has to ask permission of their congressman and get a certificate. If anyone has a kid without permission, that child is not covered for health care. Let's go all the way with government intrusion. No more fast food restaurants. Close down McDonalds, BKing and all the others. They have to sell only health foods. Or, people get scanned when going to a fast food restaurant. And if you go to those places to eat, you can't be covered on government health care. But no. This is too intrusive for the left. They want to live irresponsibly and have others pick up the tab. And the government wants to reward bad behavior. I follow the rule but will end up paying out of my pocket for the bozos that broke the rules and are now crying "help." 21. февруари 2009, 04:26:18 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. Artful Dodger:  21. февруари 2009, 04:29:28 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. Czuch:  21. февруари 2009, 12:43:53 Относно: Re: But should those who maybe bad parents be punished for the fact that they had bad parents, and bad parents before that and before that. Artful Dodger: And yet, you want a more big brother state to now cover child birth and who can raise children...... sounds rather Hitlerish to me. ... reasoning and understanding.. God like qualities I thought.  21. февруари 2009, 19:11:30 Относно: And yet, you want a more big brother state to now cover child birth and who can raise children...... sounds rather Hitlerish to me. (V):Of course that's not what I'm arguing for. I'm carrying out yours and Usurpers economic philosophy to its logical conclusion. 21. февруари 2009, 19:52:38 Относно: Re: And yet, you want a more big brother state to now cover child birth and who can raise children...... sounds rather Hitlerish to me. Artful Dodger: No you are not, and logic isn't always the best way to think when considering humans.. We are not robots, or computers. 21. февруари 2009, 19:54:13 Относно: and logic isn't always the best way to think when (V):  21. февруари 2009, 20:01:55 Относно: Re: and logic isn't always the best way to think when Artful Dodger: Ok.. the politicians would like us to be as well as certain religious groups... But it'll never happen.  21. февруари 2009, 20:04:48 Относно: V: "and logic isn't always the best way to think" (V):Yes but bananas are yellow and camels don't wear horse saddles either. But if you carry water in a bucket with a hole in it, you're sure to put too much sugar in your coffee. 21. февруари 2009, 20:07:25 Относно: Re: V: "and logic isn't always the best way to think" Artful Dodger: No, Bananas turn yellow, when picked they are green. I never use a bucket with a hole in it to carry water, it's common sense not to. And I use a teaspoon to measure my sugar in my coffee... It's a good way to cut down. 21. февруари 2009, 20:09:45 Относно: Re: V: "and logic isn't always the best way to think" (V):Don't use logic and break our own rule. 21. февруари 2009, 20:14:12 Относно: Re: V: "and logic isn't always the best way to think" Artful Dodger: Common sense is not logic, it's simple right action. "our rule"? 21. февруари 2009, 21:54:17 Относно: Ten pound POMS  (V): what has the fact that"ten pound POMS" came to australia more than 50 years ago got to do with what I was saying? (this is where we need a compulsory subject line) **No, Bananas turn yellow, when picked they are green.** they turn yellow after they are subjected to a hell of a lot of ripening gas. The only time bananas turn yellow naturally is when they are grown in someones backyard...I have them growing and you wait months for them to ripen. 21. февруари 2009, 23:08:01 Относно: Re: Ten pound POMS Bernice:  Nope.... It's a natural process, on transit to europe they are prevented from ripening....Plus also, Their are ladies fingers... a yellow pink banana and red bananas, also known as Makabu which turn purplish red when ripe. 21. февруари 2009, 23:51:44 Относно: Re: Ten pound POMS (V):I grow lady fingers....and they aren't yellowpink....they are also called sugar bananas. I live in THE banana capital of australia.....millions of tonnes are grown here each year, along with sugar cane. They are shipped green and are GASSED when they arrive at their destination. A bunch of bananas can take up to 6 months to ripen, and to hurry them along they are gassed. CCP***Bananas need exposure to a naturally occurring gas called ethylene in order to ripen properly. Homeowners can "gas" their own bananas by placing them in an airtight plastic bag with several apples, which naturally emit the gas.*** CCP***Gassing bananas. This process, little known to consumers, is a bit of production wizardry that enhances profit. Bananas are grown in the tropics, a fairly long way from the world’s population centers. Consequently, they are picked while quite green so they do not over-ripen before they reach the market. When they near their destinations they are warehoused where they are exposed to Ethylene gas for a day, or more, which accelerates their ripening; turning bananas into that pleasing yellow color most consumers prefer.*** 22. февруари 2009, 00:02:13 Относно: Re: Ten pound POMS Bernice: never had to gas any bananas here, they just seem to turn yellow naturally. 22. февруари 2009, 00:22:08 Относно: Re: Ten pound POMS (V): you must have different bananas to the rest of the world is all I can say. I didnt say YOU had to gas them....they ARE ALREADY GASSED before you get them....please read carefully.......EOS. 22. февруари 2009, 00:30:21 Относно: Re: Ten pound POMS Bernice: .. Well they must skip a few shipments over to here, as some.. well, I have to leave them for a week before eating. Plus I'm not sure if everyone enjoys the use of the ripening process as it is a potentially very explosive situation. 21. февруари 2009, 21:37:08 Относно: Re: And yet, you want a more big brother state to now cover child birth and who can raise children...... sounds rather Hitlerish to me. (V): and logic isn't always the best way to think when considering humans. ..is that the liberal secret??? I have long suspected it... suspend logical thought in favor of the heart!  Had you told us that 8 years ago, it would have saved a lot of senseless typing  21. февруари 2009, 22:08:13 Относно: Re: "suspend logical thought in favor of the heart" Czuch: You bet. Psychopaths are quite logical. You seem to misunderstand my position (purposely?). I don't love government. I love people. Could it be that you don't hate government, either...you just hate people? 21. февруари 2009, 23:15:21 Относно: Re: And yet, you want a more big brother state to now cover child birth and who can raise children...... sounds rather Hitlerish to me. Czuch: No one said stop thinking, there are many types of thinking, and from a point of statistics no-one has invented a model that can logically predict humans, as we are all individuals and the empirical nature of how we grow and learn means that apart from certain common elements depending on area, etc means any logical..ish attempt to work out a human require alot of thought. As for the heart... It is supposed to be the centre of our being, the place of reflection of the light that is I AM. Technically speaking, anyone who ignores this when thinking is having dead thoughts, not living ones and is technically not awake. 20. февруари 2009, 20:35:48 Относно: but free isnt really free, someone pays for it, the federal government gets its money from the people it works for, if everyone gets it for free and nobody pays into it, then where are you left? Czuch: Exactly. I don't see a reasonable answer to this point. I also don't get why we should lump everyone into the same category and provide health care services to everyone via a national health program. The waiting lines will be horrible. People will not get what's best for them. It will be assembly line care. Good when you get your turn but while you are waiting.......not so much. 20. февруари 2009, 20:36:43 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: Does it? So only money is a well worth target and goal and things like curing a disease, or finding out the nature of the universe have no merit and can only be worked out in capitalist countries? One says that greatness comes from being who you are, I thought that came from just a basic right to be able to think freely. 20. февруари 2009, 22:36:21 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" (V): things like curing a disease, or finding out the nature of the universe have no merit Dude! All that stuff takes money... it all takes money, everything takes money, someone somewhere has to make money, socialism doesnt work at all if there isnt anyone around actually doing something productive. Capitalism promotes productivity, socialism sucks it dry (reminds me of an old girlfriend, but I digress) I just dont get it... you suck 70% from the productive people to give it to the unproductive people so that the unproductive people can have the same life as the productive people until the productive people have been reduced to the middle class and have given enough to the unproductive people to make them middle class, and now you have a whole nation of middle class, everyones dream has come true, no poor no rich just one big happy middle class... now what??? 20. февруари 2009, 23:04:23 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: Dude.... To think doesn't take money. Capitalism doesn't work either if no-one is productive. Actually, they had (so the legend goes) worked out a way of making Socialism work in the USSR... some people were asked to think it through... But the problem was to many did not want to give up the power and goodies that came with the solution. Bit like your med companies costing so much to be insured for so little return. And be reasonable, even the Bible which could ethically be said to be a socialist view but with a spiritual twist recognises no-one is equal in who they are and what they can do. ... Everyone has different Chi. 20. февруари 2009, 23:15:09 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" (V): Capitalism doesn't work either if no-one is productive. Yes, but capitalism rewards productivity, and socialism does not!!!!! How productive are you really going to be if 70% goes to someone who is being unproductive? I hear you guys brag about have 6 weeks off a year or whatever it is(probably more) and laugh how hard Americans work compared to you... well that says it all, capitalists are more productive than socialists..... 20. февруари 2009, 23:22:59 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: 6 Weeks?? Usually it's 4... management can get more, like when Bush took so much holiday off before 9/11  We don't get duvet days either officially....... And what is with this 70%, explain it more, is it some figure some guy has made up based on one case to demonise our system? 20. февруари 2009, 23:27:46 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" (V): First, the president is on duty 24/7 second, I am referring more to Denmark, or swedes or one of those that are more socialized than yourself, like I said, you guys are more similar to us, we have many social programs already, and now even more, soon the banks and the health care maybe the autos, where does it end? 20. февруари 2009, 23:35:11 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: Better for you. No more cheating health companies. 21. февруари 2009, 00:25:56 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" (V): Better for you. No more cheating health companies. I am not saying that there are potential upsides to some of what we get with socialism.... my opinion is that there are many down sides as well, and I am willing to put up with the loss of the upsides to not have to deal with the down sides. In other words, I also know that capitalism is not perfect, but neither is socialism, and i think that the advantages of capitalism out weigh the disadvantages, and that the downside from socialism out weigh the advantages, although I am not against some limited forms of government regulations and even some socialized policies. 21. февруари 2009, 00:27:40 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: Czuch, you are a fence sitting middle of the road no idea no convictions cop out of a person.... 21. февруари 2009, 00:29:12 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: hey, no ad homenum attacks.... what the heck is ad homenem anyway??? 21. февруари 2009, 01:55:10 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: That's very original advice, by the way. I've only heard it coming from the mouths of every rightwing talk show pundit in recent memory. You are some free thinker... 21. февруари 2009, 12:53:11 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: Then regulate properly your health insurance companies. Make them show data on themselves, cap their profits at the expense of USA Joe, and make the insurance system more honest and less prone to being defrauded by Heath companies and doctors in the sway of drug companies. 21. февруари 2009, 01:52:45 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Czuch: For moving expenses, I mean, so I can leave this country that disappoints me so much, per your sage advice. 20. февруари 2009, 20:37:15 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" (V): Americans are tying to get the Canadian costs for drugs, not medical care. And Canadian are coming to the US in droves for our superior health care syste. 20. февруари 2009, 20:50:42 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" Artful Dodger: Not what I hear, I hear that Americans can save 30-60% on health costs in Canada. Plus.. you know a certain number of Americans goto Cuba. ... There was one case where 9/11 emergency workers had been denied full treatment due to insurance matters... The Cuban doc's just said "send them over here, they are hero's, there should be no denying them care".... 20. февруари 2009, 22:42:29 Относно: Re: "free health care is a meaningless point" (V): Plus.. you know a certain number of Americans goto Cuba. ... There was one case where 9/11 emergency workers had been denied full treatment due to insurance matters... The Cuban doc's just said "send them over here, they are hero's, there should be no denying them care".... Talk about someone listening to the propaganda channel |
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