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19. januari 2011, 13:14:12
SL-Mark 
Onderwerp: Re: Minimum wage
Übergeek 바둑이: Oh dear, bit surprised at the quality of your argument, which are usually well formulated. Here you have resorted to emotive language to support your argument, there is no chronology, instead you jump around history, picking examples to support your case and mix up the argument by bringing the responsibility of other legislation into the frame.

If that is not clear, let me demonstrate some of the many fallacies in your argument.

>“The minimum wage damages the economy because those rich people who own business have to pay more to their workers and that means that the profits of the rich get a little bit smaller”
True, and I'm sure you don't need me to spell out the reasons why this is actually destructive in creating wealth for a nation.

>”We should go back to the 19th century and eliminate the minimum wage. In that way children will go back to work, women will get paid a lot less, older workers can be easily replaced by younger ones, and the rich business owners can "improve their economy" by keeping those wages for themselves.”
This is emotive and history conveniently starts in the 19th century for your argument. I suggest you look back to the two previous centuries and understand the situation and the transitions that were made from then to today. Hint, suggest you also look at population growth during these periods as well and the reasons behind this phenomenal growth.
Also, there is also no evidence to suggest that children etc. will go back to work if the minimum wage is abolished. This is the remit of other legislation, including health & safety, which has done much to ensure the safety of the work force.

>”On the plus side, those rich business owners will stop sending jobs by "outsourcing" overseas. Since there is no minimum wage, business owners don't have to open factories in poor countries. Everything can be manufactured cheaply right here at home”
Very true, and this increases the wealth of the nation. However, your terminology, “those rich business owners” is again emotive. These people you speak of took risk, provided opportunity to many and improved life for all. Look at any old city and ask yourself who built those magnificent houses, art galleries, theatres, universities, museums, railways, etc. etc. It was not government.

>”Let's face it. The minimum wage just leads to lazy, stubborn, unskilled workers.”
True, very well spotted!

>“That is why in the 19th century those handmade goods were made without skill or ability.”
False, 19th century goods are highly sought. They were made by very skilled craftsmen. What are you antique stores full of? Certainly not modern day dross.

>”By giving people a minimum wage there is just no "incentive" to learn and be productive.”
Again, well spotted, though I would say less incentive rather than no incentive. This is based on the degree that differentiation has been diminished.

>” Proof lies in the fact that in the 19th century when there was no minimum wage "soooo" many people were educated and literate as compared to today when the minimum wage allows the working class to pay for an education for their children.”
Proof of what? You have not made any assertion or hypothesis. What is the relationship between the minimum wage and education? Again, suggest you look at history without conveniently starting in a place that suits your argument. The industrial revolution did more for the health and education for the nation than any government.

>”We should get rid of the minimum wage, along with employment insurance, health care and universally available education. In that way we can go back to the good old days when the poor were so desperate that communism actually looked attractive.”
Employment insurance- What are you talking about?
Health Care- The best health care in the world is privately run. The UK state run health care is one of the worst in the world.
Education- Again, the best education is privately run. The Industrial revolution, however, provided more learning opportunities for more people than ever before in history. Oh yes, this only came about because of your greedy business owners, not government.

Like V, you need to try harder. Score 1/10. The 1 awarded, because even in your confusion you managed to get a couple of things right!

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