anastasia: I think man can stop the climate changes from going any further by reducing polution and other greenhouse gasses into the air.....plant more trees,preserve what we have


Before man and our pollution and our greenhouse gases, what cause the climate to change back then?

Eriisa: That was a really interesting article!! Thanks for posting it!

coan.net: You might as well just put the Sham Wow guy in office.I don't think my cynicism can get any lower.

Jim Dandy: yes I did - kind of "happy" news here where I work....... even though I don't like the idea of spending more money on a special election to pick Obama's replacement because of costs when there is already not enough money to go around.... but I don't like the idea of the governor picking either......

coan.net: He's in alot of trouble,did you not hear of his arrest today?

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/12/09/blagojevich.affidavit/?iref=mpstoryview

Jim Dandy: Well first he took the money from our local state park which was scheduled to close at the end of November - and after a lot of people calling daily, our local park is one of the few that got the money back to stay open.

Of course I also work at a non-profit agency in his state, and his cut backs on money we normally get from the state has hurt.

Oh, I don't like him very much.........

He's been a bad bad boy,and I'm not speaking of the use of aerosol deodorant.

Scientists Test Artificial Upwelling

I saw a fascinating (to me anyway) show on Planet Green channel about a team of scientist that are testing ways to increase plankton in barren areas of the ocean.  They think this would help with decreasing levels of CO² and slow down the Greenhouse effect.

The link is to an article about the work.

One thing I thought was really cool was while the test was not a complete sucess (the tubes were ripped to shreds by the currents), one pump worked for about 56 hours.  and within 12 days after that, a lot of marine life showed up in the area.  Before the placement, there was no marine life at all there.

wow! what the heck happened there,LMAO!!! I guess I REALLY REALLY agree,huh!!

Artful Dodger: I agree with everything you say :)
I'm not down on you guys that don't think global warming is real,honestly I'm not...I think this is a really awesome debate we have going,and for the most part,been very friendly and both sides of the issue is getting out there!!
Glad to hear that you recycle anf are doing your part to help things out!!!

Artful Dodger: I agree with everything you say :)
I'm not down on you guys that don't think global warming is real,honestly I'm not...I think this is a really awesome debate we have going,and for the most part,been very friendly and both sides of the issue is getting out there!!
Glad to hear that you recycle anf are doing your part to help things out!!!

Artful Dodger: I agree with everything you say :)
I'm not down on you guys that don't think global warming is real,honestly I'm not...I think this is a really awesome debate we have going,and for the most part,been very friendly and both sides of the issue is getting out there!!
Glad to hear that you recycle anf are doing your part to help things out!!!

Pedro Martínez: Most creation stories refer to the Earth as being feminine. For eg the Maori creation story refers to the sky being Father and the Earth being Mother.

In Judaism the Adam is formed out of the Adamah "אדםה" which is the female form of ground. And as far as I've always been taught, it is right and only proper to refer to Earth as "Mother Earth"

And no, maybe stopping the pollutants may not stop natural variations in the Earth's weather... But It'll reduce our impact.

Charles Martel: I wonder about that myself...you say global warming,stop this,stop that..and then get into a jet and fly to all your speaking engagements...weird stuff,ehh?

Pedro Martínez: I never said move back to caves and stop using pollutants altho cutting back on polutats would be bad...why???...I did however say,if we cut a tree,plant a tree,preserve what we have...No need to aploigize for your opinion,however why I am I the threat? Because I want to make this planet a better place? To not pollute it so much??..hang me up,I want to plant a tree and save an owl..OMG run for the hills!! Hide your kids!!!

AL Gore is a phony blowhard and has been his whole life as a spoiled rich kid, just as bad or worse than bush.. as in he latched onto global warming, but he jetsets to Aspen with the best of them like maddonna and the other hollywood types, brad pitt , jolie, streisand, of course these royalty are ever so more important

anastasia: Yes, I've noticed. Earth is always referred to in the feminine manner...by you.

So if we said OK, now we'll move back to caves, stop using all the "pollutants", etc etc, it would stop the sea level from rising, it would stop the glaciers from melting? I have to apologize to you for what I am now going to say, but that's just an unbelievable ignorance of the entire history of our planet, it's just so ridiculous. You know what's the biggest threat to Earth? People like you.

Pedro Martínez: her...Earth is always referred to in the feminan manner ;)
I think man can stop the climate changes from going any further by reducing polution and other greenhouse gasses into the air.....plant more trees,preserve what we have

anastasia: Do you really think that man can reverse the climate changes? How would that be possible? Earth will do what he wants to do and nothing will stop him...

Czuch: Over here they show the Gore film at schools, but they also state that it's not that accurate in certain details.

That's why I read and listen to the scientific community who are the ones advising our governments on what's going on.

(V): I also remember when they were banned...my Dad was glad of it too

Czuch: I would say no,lol...BUT if we don't change things NOW,then what??

(V): I dont think anybody is arguing that man does not have an effect on the planet!

Its just are we really 1 year away from irreversible and catastrophic problems if we dont ruin our economy even more by adopting the Kyoto protocol?

This is so true! I mean, are we supposed to believe that..... if Gore did not get ripped off from becoming president he never would have figured out that we only had 3 years left to save the planet from irreversible climate change? (that was 2 years ago)

Whew! How close was that one then? Everybody complaining that he really won the presidency, but if he had, the world would be lost forever!

anastasia: I remember when all the aerosols containing cfc's were banned. It wasn't a long debate... They banned them.

anastasia: Similar problems are happening in India, where men, women and kids are taking computers apart for the valuable elements with no protection against the dangerous chemicals needed to do the job or those produced from recycling them. Something that would be banned full stop from happening in the 'west'.

Vikings: Um actually the scientists from what I've seen will debate the evidence behind Global warming.... And as for Greenland.. Isn't it true that ice sheets around it are disintegrating?

And as a statement of how we can affect the planet... 14 years after the accident at Chernobyl sheep in Wales still had to be checked to see what their radiation levels were and if they were safe to sell for meat.

(V): you have to dipose of them that way in the staes too...Before my Dad died,he was a heating/cooling/general contractor and I remember when he had to go to school to learn how to reclaim the freeon (sp,sorry) and he had to buy a reclaimer also,which was a VERY shiney penney or 2,lol.But yeah,you have to be a licensed tech to do that.

Nirvana: wow,I just watched that,unreal!! Thank you for finding that for me :)

Artful Dodger: Sorry, but the fact that CFC's were destroying the Ozone layer is a fact. There is no point in you disputing this as the chemical reactions of CFC's on ozone is well established. That's why if you (well in the UK anyway) dump your old fridge it has to be done via a special unit (rather then just putting it on a dump) to recover and dispose of the gasses in the cooling system safely.

Vikings: IMO it is absolute arrogance to think that man can cause global warming

And in MY opinion...it is absolute ignorance to think that we play no part in it

Universal Eyes: We should follow the example of the Native Americans...they respect the earth as a being and SHOW her the respect she deserves.
And good point to bring up about taking a tree,planting a tree...tress do after all,help provide us with oxygen...you cut down to many,and never replace them,because as you point out,WHERE would you plant them? We are taking all the land to build stuff on...so less trees,less "filtering" the trees can do...It goes back to my example of the exaust fan in the room.

Artful Dodger: I respect our difference of opinions on this,but I AM glad to see that you help by recycling and help take care of the environment...I can't ask,nor would I ever ask any of you to change your opionins,THAT is what makes debates fun after all,right,but I am glad that you seem not to take things on this planet for granted

Bernice: and anastasia I think you mean this:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/11/06/60minutes/main4579229.shtml

Vikings:For Centuries the Native Indians have claimed to be able to make it rain,but as well they have been located to reserves where they live with nature and live off the land so there is a great better understanding of knowing what your losing,as in respect to global warming and being able to appreciate the planet as they say you are what you eat,therefor if you use something you better be able to replace it,as in if you cut a tree down plant another,but if you cut too many trees to build too many homes, where will you plant the next one,i guess space aviation is more important than our planet.

IMO it is absolute arrogance to think that man can cause global warming, Key word is GLOBAL!
For centuries man has attempted to make it rain result failure, man has attempted to stop every weather related disaster, result, failure. everything that causes the earth to heat produces the needed changes to cool the earth. everything that causes holes in the o-zone also produces the things that stop the holes, whales are trapped in the north atlantic from ice this year earlier than any other redcorded year, Last years cold temperatures entirely wiped away the last 100 years of heating so as a result no change in the climate temps. Snow is actually thicker in greenland, by the way why is greenland called greenland? Man tries to conserve forest by not allowing clearing or maintenance result failure. Every scare tactic used by either these fraudes or misguided people with good intentions has proved false starting with the first one I can remember, John Denver and his"by 2000, there will be no trees".
These are just my opinions that I will never change because no one can prove them wrong same as not one of these scientific pieces of evidence can hold up to any real scrutiny, which is why all these scientific experts refuse to debate anybody of significance

Artful Dodger: seriously?

Bernice: yes,that sounds like the part of it I heard....all kinds of birth defects and stuff??

anastasia: I think it is a place in china...you cant drink the water or breathe the air, and the children have lead? in their blood, but I cant be sure...I think it was on 60 minutes

(V): I'm not implying we are not suppose to be here,I am implying that we take and take and take...we need to stop and look around at what we are doing to this planet.

Artful Dodger: and like I had said...yes,the earth DOES cycle BUT we are overloading it...the population,the polution....hey,did anyone happen to see,there was a report,I want to say maybe Dateline or 20/20...about the most toxic place on earth?? the death rate and cancer rate was through the roof?? anyone see that to know where they were talking about?

Artful Dodger: As I said, are you 100% sure that global warming is all hype? As you have just said we do have an impact on the planet....

Maybe those on the supreme court are not scientists, but those in the EPA are or have access to them don't they.

... And the scientists appear to be about 90% sure we are making an impact.

Also your Federal Climate Change Program commissioned By Bush states....

"....Studies ... show clear evidence of human influences on the climate system (due to changes in greenhouse gases, aerosols, and stratospheric ozone). ... The observed patterns of change over the past 50 years cannot be explained by natural processes alone, nor by the effects of short-lived atmospheric constituents (such as aerosols and tropospheric ozone) alone."

And that your supreme court has decided that CO2 is a pollutant.....

....".... under the federal air quality law and told the EPA it must determine whether CO2's link to climate change endangers public health or welfare."

Artful Dodger: Are you 100% sure we have no impact on this planets weather? If that's so then why did London pass a clean air act to stop the fumes from coal fires making the sir so bad that people were dying from it... Again with London or more specifically the Thames, we polluted that river so badly that if anyone fell in it at one time it was more then likely they died from poisoning?

anastasia: I think because it implies we ain't supposed to here. While I agree we have mucked things up and not really thought about our impact on this world and how our use of resources and chemicals has been reckless and in some cases very dangerous....

.... We live here, we may only be borrowing it (as the saying goes) from our children, but we live here.

We are not parasites, just foolish and often those in power or in industry just don't think things through.. or the tech is just not there to understand the impact.

Eg these new anti ageing agents with nano-tech.... No-one really knows the long term impact of using such agents on the skin, or so certain scientists are saying.

Pedro Martínez: why?

Pedro Martínez: Sounds like my favorite Futurama celebrity: http://theinfosphere.org/Richard_Nixon%27s_head

anastasia:

Humans are a parasite...a cancer on this earth

I just hope you are not being serious...

anastasia: Nahhh the earth won't dump us.... but we might do so much damage through not understanding our impact properly that the earth might become a hostile enviroment causing the deaths of millions upon millions.

..... people will be fighting over good living places and it won't be pretty.

Czuch: BTW, last i heard, the ice glaciers were growing again?
could you send me a link on THAT one,I would be interested in reading it.
And yes,I AM suggesting that we are changing nature.
Agreed that the earth goes through her own heating/cooling cycles,but humans and all of our greenhouse gasses and polution and waiste,and definatly adding to the warming effect and essetially throwing off the earths cycle of balance.Put 100 people in a small room,think will eventually start to get warmer?? now have some of them smoke,now have a few cans of hairspray spraying,now have put some animlas in there with ya,maybe a running car or 2...after,oh lets say...not even a day,ya THINK it will start to get a bit nasty in that room?? Even IF you had a good ventalation system installed,one that would have worked perfectly fine for say,you and your family....start throwing other stuff into that mix and you ventilation system doesn't do such a good job anymore does it??
Humans are a parasite...a cancer on this earth,and one day she will have enough of us abusing and taking her for granted and find her own way to get rid of us...I just hope when that day comes,the earth isn't so far beyond it own repair that it becomes a waisteland