Five Royal Marines have been charged with murder over an incident in Afghanistan in 2011, the MoD has said. It says nine marines were arrested over the incident, involving an insurgent. Four have been released without charge.

The five charged remain in custody, and the next stage of the process is likely to be trial by court martial. The marines were arrested by the Royal Military Police after suspicious video footage was found on a serviceman's laptop by civilian police in the UK.

The charges are related to an incident in Afghanistan last year, when Royal Marine 3 Commando Brigade was based in Helmand. The MoD previously said the incident followed an "engagement with an insurgent" and no civilians were involved. It is believed to be the first time UK servicemen have been arrested and charged with such charges during the Afghanistan conflict.

The Service Prosecuting Authority (SPA), an independent body that conducts prosecutions on behalf of the military, decided the five should face murder charges. Speaking on the BBC's Andrew Marr Show, Defence Secretary Philip Hammond did not comment on the specifics of the case but insisted the MoD was "determined that rules of engagement" be followed.

He added: "Everybody serving in theatre knows the rules of engagement, they carry cards in their uniforms with the rules on them in case they should need to remind themselves." During a six-month tour of duty, which lasted from April to October last year, seven servicemen from 3 Commando Brigade were killed in action, all from 42 Commando.

A court martial is a public court with similar powers to a crown court. It can impose prison sentences, fines or other forms of justice depending upon the nature of the crime. They are presided over by a judge advocate and a board of up to seven lay members, individuals with no legal training much like a jury in civilian courts.

The MoD said it would be inappropriate to comment further on the ongoing investigation.

Iamon lyme: Which type? I approve of a certain body we have here called "trading standards", guarantee, contract, contract as laid down in statutes of law that are statuary, and the magic roundabout... as well as responsibility not to use one if you don't know how..

... seeing videos of men cutting trees down wrong, seeing guys on "Watchdog" use the wrong chain saw for a job.. I've seen.

All this comes to mind when as a customer you enter into a shop to buy a chainsaw. Contract law starts at the point of sale, as does it for the shop owner when buying it from the manufacturer.

This is the UK... not the US with multi million dollar pay outs. This is how our law sees it.

Iamon lyme: well they are blaming her department now. It's always the fault of someone else.

Artful Dodger: Seriously? He wants to toss Hillary under the bus now? I can't keep up with all of these new developments... and it keeps getting weirder as it goes along.

Artful Dodger: [ the cheerleaders are transvestites ]

What about those other ones? Are those bananas or are they just happy to see me?

Iamon lyme: the administration lied and now obummer is trying to blame Hillary.

Artful Dodger: Libyas leader apologized and said the attack was planned. He even contradicted Obama (well shame on him) by saying it had nothing to do with the video. It's interesting that Libyas leader knew why it happened to OUR ambassador while OUR president apparently doesn't have a clue, and thinks it happened because of some youtube video.

A request for extra security was turned down shortly before it happened, but apparently no one in Obamas administration knew about that. Not even Hiliary, and it's her job to deal with things like that. With this president it's not "What did he know and when did he know it?", but if you can believe the narrative coming from Obama's own mouth then apparently it's "What did he not know and when did he not know it?"

Who in their right mind was expecting nothing to happen on the anniversary of 9/11? It means more to the terrorists than it does for many of us, so of course they were planning to do something. Even if Osama had not been taken out, expecting nothing to happen is insane.

Seriously, was the timing of the attack just a coincidence?

Iamon lyme: they cheerleaders are transvestites

Artful Dodger: I don't know if my eyes have gone bad, or maybe something is wrong with my screen, but those little round cheerleaders look like they all have five o'clock shadows. It's kind of a turn off, if you know what I mean.

Artful Dodger: Oh good, something to look at that hasn't anything to do with me... me me me me me me me me me me... ack, I'm started to sound like a narcissist, and it's making me sick. Ack, ack, patuey... it's like eating nothing but sugar... ack...

An excuse or a strawman... still trying to figure out what that means.

What could my being a former liberal Democrat be used as an excuse for? And in what universe can building a false persona (a strawman of myself, really?) help anyone's argument? Does it really matter to anyone here who I am or what I was?

I was a liberal Democrat for a relatively short time, considering how old I am now. I married a liberal Democrat, and she came a family of like minded thinkers, so you can imagine how they all felt about an acceptable atheist/liberal/Democrat inlaw becoming a Christian/conservative/Republican inlaw.

It didn't just happen over night, my views gradually changed over a 30 to 40 year period of time. And it's not an excuse for anything, or a straw man argument for persuading anyone, it's just a fact. Granted, it has nothing to do with anything I might say about abortion or politics, or the politics of abortion... I'm just letting ya'll know where I came from and where I am now.

No one is born a Democrat or a Republican, just like no is born an atheist or a believer in God simply because of genetics or family connections. Some people make life decisions based on what their family and friends believe, and I did as well, but I changed my mind.

I am only me. Remove the spaces and it reads Iamonlyme. Then add a space and you have Iamon lyme. See? That's who I am.

Politics
Fox News beats network, cable competitors in vice-presidential debate ratings

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/10/12/fox-news-beats-network-cable-competitors-in-vice-presidential-debate-ratings/#ixzz29EHb5nuk

(V): Very well, you did not answer so I will ask again...

Do you approve of chain saws?


[ Mote comes to mind ]

Very good, that's an improvement. Anything else getting in up there?

Iamon lyme: Why do you think that of others?

Mote comes to mind

mckinley: [ It's ok to kill criminals when you aren't to judge? I'm against all killing. ]

Why do you assume I'm okay with any killing? If I'm against the killing of innocents, then you assume I'm okay with war or any other thing poeple do that causes death and destruction. It's a phony argument where you pretend to speak for both sides. It's called a straw man argument, but I suspect you already know that. I don't assume any of you who do this are stupid or ill informed simply because you attempt to cheat in arguments on a message board.

But if you insist on making this kind of assumption then fine, I can do the same about any of you. I could make the same assumption about anyone who thinks abortion is okay, and if I did my assumption would have more merit... Because if you don't have a problem with killing the weakest and most innocent of humans, then why should I assume you wouldn't have a problem with anyone else being killed? If you are unfaithful in a small matter (small to you perhaps) then you will be unfaithful in larger matters. Jesus said that in a different way, but you are free to ignore him whenever it doesn't suit you.

The Col: Nooooo, just an excuse... like using God, or babies. If the American conservative Christians were as being 'stated', then the mess of Agent Orange would have been cleared up decades ago.

They'd have marched on Washington!

(V): You buy that? I don't, just a strawman he created.

mckinley: Killing of unborn babies is against Obama and Biden's PERSONAL beliefs but they are ok if OTHERS do the killing?

Yeah, I'm personally opposed to the lynching of blacks but.....

Yeah, I'm personally opposed to the killing of Jews but......

mckinley: Nonsense. Give a concrete example. Biden is a buffoon.

mckinley: The conservatives ARE doing something about it. But the liberals LOVE to keep the culture of death active. They are willing to allow the unborn to be killed just for votes.

mckinley: Well... all those arms companies in the USA are reliant wars..... rednecks, doomsday preppers!!

mckinley: For what purpose would he keep it going? Distraction?? If the economy gets bad they can just occupy the front pages with more brave men and women dying in a foreign field figures and pictures!

mckinley: They can't do anything that's why. To ban abortion would be as such recreating the times when women were second class citizens with no real vote or say in their lives. The rich who want an abortion will find a good private doctor, or go abroad.. the poor well, they don't count we've been told by Romney and by people here on this board.

US is equal bottom with Mexico on child deaths from maltreatment. It has the worst record in the industrialised world regarding child abuse. Part of the problem is this idea of keeping families together no matter what that is advocated by certain parties.

No one likes abortion, but that does not mean others have the right to send it back into the back street era.

mckinley: Well it beats trying to win in Afghanistan. No one ever has, and without using WMD's (aka nukes)... no-one ever will.

Artful Dodger: If abortion had already been legal long before the effort was made to make it legal, I wonder how many pro-abortion advocates would not exist because someone decided it would be more convenient to not let them live beyond the womb? I've posed that question before, and was somewhat surprised by the response.

The response is almost always the same: It didn't matter to them if they were born or not, they still believed it was okay to arbitrarily end the life of a child, just so long as that child was too young to know anything.

Yeah, right... more like as long as that child was too young to defend itself or complain about it. Their response was meaningless, because the people to whom I posed the question already knew their existence was safe and always had been.

Liberals lack all of the virtues they want us to believe they extol, and chief among those virtues is empathy. They feel nothing for the people they victimize, and expect nothing but praise for their efforts.

Iamon lyme: How anyone in good conscience can condone such barbaric acts and then in the same breath complain about war. Evil. And the liberals defend it.

Artful Dodger: There are survivors of botched abortions. The first one I heard about lost one of his arms because it was the first body part to be pulled out. When the abortionist saw it he panicked because he realised the baby was fully formed and ready to be born. Back when that happened only babies in the first term (the first three months of development) could be legally killed. The mother had lied about how far along she was, so the attending doctor had no other choice than to safely remove the baby and let him live. Or let her live, I don't recall the gender of the child... as though that should make any difference to liberals, they are equal opportunity baby killers in this country. Not so much in other countries, where gender does make a difference in determining whether the childs life should be terminated or not.

Iamon lyme: Yeah, the liberals are still trying to kill her yelling, "You're supposed to be dead! You're giving abortion a bad name! Die you little K*$)#Y@#O!!!!"

Artful Dodger: She survived her abortion, and has been on the run ever since. If you see this illegal child do not approach her, but instead call your local authorities.

Iamon lyme: JUles approves of killing the unborn AND allowing for babies just born to be left to die. It's in his DNA.

(V): Do you approve of chain saws?

(V): [ Literal cluster bombs... it has relevance. ]

Relevance to what? I have no problem with you using cluster bombs in your video games if they are available to you. IMO the only possible victim in such a game is the player. It's up to you how you want to spend your time, that's not my call, so your question in regard to video war games is with all due respect irrelevant.

If you are asking if I personally approve of cluster bombs, I can't help you out with that either because implements of war isn't a specialty of mine. I take it you do not approve of them, but in the interest of schlepping this line of thought flowing onward and keeping you otherwise occupied as theives break into your place and tippy toe out the door with some things in your fridge you would not want to part with how do you feel about guns or knives? How about protective shielding, or is that cheating?

On tonight's HIGNFY, it was pointed out that while "The Daily Mail Online" is rightfully laying into Jimmy Savile, it's own history of picture taking is far from moral regarding under-age children. It is also noted that as soon as any female reaches 16 she is fair game. Many articles can be found under a search of the site with three words...

... "all grown up".

It was also noted that pictures of celeb women in all manners of attire are perfectly ok on the site

... You see.. in those stories it's all about how the women's sizes keep changing.

So playing



Is bad? I kill demons me!!

Iamon lyme: Literal cluster bombs... it has relevance.

(V): [ Do you approve of cluster bombs? ]

Are you talking about literal bombs used in actual wars, or are you refering to what it is you do when you are losing ground in a debate and so begin "lobbing bombs"? I have to assume it's the second meaning because I either missed the discussion on the use of (literal) cluster bombs, or you are wanting to change the subject and talk about the use of (literal) cluster bombs. So before I can answer your question it is necessary that I must ask which is it?

Are you asking about literal or figurative cluster bombs?

Iamon lyme: I am as I am. No more and no less and content with that.

Do you approve of cluster bombs?

(V): [ Does your DNA approve of cluster bombs? ]

Is telegraphing your moves after the fact encoded in yours?

Iamon lyme: ahhh the 'ex liberal'.. just like ex smokers. Ok.. we get it, you had a revelation and realised you could blame things on being liberal.

Isn't that though a bit hypocritical, as apparently we can't blame Bush anymore!

Does your DNA approve of cluster bombs?