The Usurper:  apology accepted 

Artful Dodger: “nutty theories”
“unknown nut cases”
“conspiracy theorists”
“a bunch of land in a Florida swamp”
“wacky theory”
“conspiracy nuts”

Well, Dan, these are nice emotional outbursts if somewhat ad hominem when referring to legitimate argumentation.

I apologize for my misconceived notion of comparing you to the distinguished ethical theologian, David Ray Griffin.

Bernice: I didn't know you aren't American. I won't trade insults. You are a citizen of the world, of course. :o)

Bernice:As there are dozens of books on 911 theories, I guess one should really read them all.  Amazon.com has 4 pages of books but most 911 conspiracy books are not sold on Amazon.  I would guess there are hundreds.  There are thousands of websites.  People love a conspiracy.

It just cracks me up that "experts" will disagree about a given idea but each one insists their view is the correct one.  They all say, "just look at the facts" but that is just plain stupid.  If two ideas conflict, either they are both false, or one is false and the other true.  So when competing ideas all claim to have "the truth" backed up by "the facts" one is better off going to the zoo and asking a baboon what he thinks.  He likely would stick his butt in your face which would make more sense than some of these wacky theories. 

The Usurper: is there something wrong with your mind/head/thinking.

Im not american, so what you are saying directly to me is all bulls---t....

I didnt realize you were so boring before, I always looked upon you as being a sort of "fairy" figure LOL....you know what that is? one who believes in fairies of both kinds LOL

I have little to no interest in nutty theories by unknown nut cases that ignore real evidence and promote falsehoods.  People can believe what they want.  I say those that claim there was "no plane" at the Pentagon are simply nut cases.  And anyone who claims that the inept Bush administration was able to pull off a major conspiracy, blow up several buildings, cause 4 airliners  full of US passengers to crash after get volunteers to hijack the planes and then crash them  (and commit suicide--I'm almost convinced now!) AND NOBODY ON THE INSIDE HAS COME FORWARD TO TELL THE "TRUTH."  Can you say Watergate???

I think these conspiracy theorists are the same guys that just bought a bunch of land in a Florida swamp too.  Yeah, and Randi has proven Jesus never existed (even tho there is more evidence of Jesus' existence than there is evidence that Randi exists). 

Ever notice how after hundreds of experts in their fields testify to the truth about 911 (debunking the nut cases) and some refuse to believes the experts.  But along comes a guy that studied at a Bible college, has a wacky theory, and they listen to him and hang on his every word.  Can you say gullible?

Seriously, conspiracy nuts are people who cannot think for themselves.  They are irrational.  Be amused by them, but don't take them seriously.  Think man, think.

Artful Dodger: :o)

I would only recommend you read Griffin before you gather your talking points.

Seriously Dan, just having re-read "The New Pearl Harbor," it reads like a book YOU would have written...the thorough research, the organizational skill, the lucid presentation of points, etc.

David Ray Griffin:
still promotes "no plane" hoax,
promotes Holocaust deniers as credible sources
distrusts the hundreds of eyewitnesses who saw Flight 77 hit the Pentagon or cleaned up the plane parts afterwards

Artful Dodger: lol

Bernice: Ok, politics.

Your government is using 9/11, which is a false-flag operation in common with a history of false-flag operations, as a Pretext for a global domination strategy (including the military control of space, as well as control of Eurasia by controlling the oil reserves in Central Asia) which is resulting in the deaths of 100s of thousands, if not millions, of innocent men, women & children in the Middle East...for starters. And you, as an American citizen, have a responsibility to know what your government is doing & why...and then, to participate in the process for or against, etc.

Is that political enough? :o)

Well at least now we know where you get your nutty ideas. 

lets talk politics.........

Everyone believes in conspiracies. After all, whenever two or more people secretly collude to perform an action which effects others not in the know, it is a conspiracy. In the case of 9/11, some believe the official conspiracy theory, according to which Osama bin Ladin & others colluded in a cave in Afghanistan to pull off a miracle & succeeded. Others believe the conspiracy lies closer to home, that bin Ladin is the scapegoat, etc. As such, the pejorative term "conspiracy theory", as it does not add qualitatively to the debate, ought to be set aside by all serious thinkers & inquirers.

Popular Mechanics

I hold in my hand a book written by David Ray Griffin (theologian with over 20 books published) a book entitled: "Debunking 9/11 Dubunking: An Answer to Popular Mechanics and Other Defenders of the Official Conspiracy Theory".

Griffin argues his case using evidence gleaned from architects, demolition experts, engineers, physicists, federal government employees from many agencies, firemen on the scene, eye-witness accounts, etc.

It is highly recommened reading, but here is one interesting quote about it:

"Professor Griffin is the nemesis of the 9/11 cover-up. This new book destroys the credibility of the NIST and Popular Mechanics reports and annihilates his critics." - Paul Craig Roberts, Assistant Secretary of the US Treasury during the Reagan administration

But I would first recommend Griffin's first two books on the subject: "The New Pearl Harbor: Disturbing Questions about the Bush Administration and 9/11"; and "The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions".

Or you might just google David Ray Griffin and read some of his online articles, which are cogent, rational, and give you the gist of his arguments without purchasing a book.

But you might also want to read "Crossing the Rubicon" by Michael Rupert, which closely examines the drive for oil & global domination behind 9/11 and the so-called War on Terror.

Or you might want to read Barrie Zwicker's "Towers of Deception: The Media Cover-Up of 9/11." Or Webster Tarpley's "9/11 Synthetic Terror: Made in the U.S.A." These are just a few recommendations. There are many books by many researchers on the market.

Or, if you hate reading (in which case you might be in a bit of trouble), there are dozens of quality DVDs which cover numerous topics related to 9/11 and its coverup.

What I am attempting to demonstrate is that, right or wrong, I (and many others) are not going off half-cocked or shooting from the hip. I am talking about legitimate research. I am talking about, not a litttle, but a wealth of information, a veritable mountain of evidence, indicating an inside job. I was frankly stunned when I began to look into it with an open (if somewhat skeptical) mind.

A GREAT site for serious researchers is History Commons (historycommons.org) where a complete 9/11 timeline has been gathered from mainstream media sources all over the world.

But use your common sense for a moment and just try to answer these simple questions (off the top of my head) about the fall of the Twin Towers:

1. Why did they fall at nearly free-fall speed?
2. Why did they explode & disintegrate on the way down, pulverizing all the concrete into dust & everything else into tiny fragments?
3. Why did they fall into their own footprints, rather than topple over?
4. Why were large projectiles thrown outward from the towers (in some cases hundreds of feet) on their way down?
5. Why were squibs filmed shooting out of lower floors during the descent (an indication of demolition)?
6. Why were explosions reported by numerous eye-witnesses, including firefighters?
7. Why, in the history of the world, before or since, has a high rise steel-framed skyscraper NEVER collapsed as a result of fire, yet on 9/11 in NYC not one but THREE towers supposedly did so (this includes WTC-7, a 47-story building that fell at 5:20PM)?
8. Why were domlition rings seen around the buildings as they collapsed?
9. Why was all the steel conveniently sliced into 30-foot segments (another sign of controlled demolition) which were immediately removed & sold to China and elsewhere for scrap-iron, rather than being examined?
10. Why was molten metal found still smoldering in the sub-basement levels of all three towers WEEKS after 9/11? Do jet fuel fires burn hot enough to create molten metal?

Those are just a few questions about a single point in the argument against the official conspiracy theory. Go and look at the videos for yourself. Read the eye-witness accounts, etc. Use your brain. The bottom line....if the towers were brought down by controlled demolition (and they were), it has to be an inside job.

Vikings:

Bernice:lol, I should update my post 

Vikings: hahahaha

Artful Dodger: You forgot that the levy's in N.O. were demolition ed by navy seals, a second shooter on the grassy knoll, Area 51, miniature cameras built into everyone's t.v.'s, and of coarse, the roadrunner paid off Acme

Artful Dodger: hahaha....I thought your "here" was going to show me a couple of BK members

Bernice:Well, according to some conspiracy theorists, Elvis is still alive, Katrina was started by a government controlled weather device, and the landing on the moon was faked in a Hollywood studio.   Look up on google and you'll find plenty of websites that claim the holocaust never took place.  (over 3 million hits)

Some of these same theorists have a membership here.    and here too!

Im just dissapointed that Barack Obama didn't rush to the aid of the american/world people around the twin towers.....

Ursurper....you have me lost....I thought we were talking Osama Bin Obama El Pres....how come it turned around to 911....where have you been the last 7 years?

I am joking people so dont jump on me please LOL

HAHAHAHA @ Vikings and AD..........

Vikings:

Artful Dodger: Rosie's gone but Mel Gibson and Julia Roberts have entered the room

Buy the book and learn the truth. 

"To investigate 16 of the most prevalent claims made by conspiracy
theorists, POPULAR MECHANICS assembled a team of nine researchers and
reporters who, together with PM editors, consulted more than 70
professionals in fields that form the core content of this magazine,
including aviation, engineering and the military.

In the end, we
were able to debunk each of these assertions with hard evidence and a
healthy dose of common sense. We learned that a few theories are based
on something as innocent as a reporting error on that chaotic day.
Others are the byproducts of cynical imaginations that aim to inject
suspicion and animosity into public debate. Only by confronting such
poisonous claims with irrefutable facts can we understand what really
happened on a day that is forever seared into world history."

Is Rosie O'Donnell in here? 

Some seed fell by the wayside, some on rocky ground, the fowls of the air ate it up, etc. Some sprang up, but the plant had no root in itself (i.e., no passionate hunger for Truth at any cost) and soon withered. But some fell on good ground.

The seed has been sown. 9/11 was an Inside Job. Dare to research it!

All these other questions are pointless....left vs. right, Dems vs. Repugs...this bailout bill or the last one...they distract us, and purposely so. The seeds (the other seeds, the evil ones) of your servitude are being sown as we speak.

How many can find their way out of the Matrix?

But you know, most people wouldn't touch Truth with a thirtynine-and-a-half-foot pole.

There, the Prophet hath spoken. :o)

like when a school teacher gets paid to teach BUT the same teacher won't share his pay check with the kids that have to be there to listen to him

For those critical of capitalism and free enterprize

something to consider and understand why it's the best system anywhere.

Czuch:I dont allow smokers to use my shop floor for an ashtray...but last I checked...cigarettes are still legal in missouri, so its every adults right to be within their rights and fire one up.

I agree about the butts everywhere.... I dont know where or when it got acceptable to use the ground as a place to throw cigarette butts?

People constantly throw them out their car windows, or onto the sidewalks, and it almost seems so common that nobody even blinks an eye at it?

"GERRY":

Bernice:YES MOM     

Czuch: the ONLY reason I am leary about a real reply is because we were all yelled at once already about this *see posts below* and dunno if our stuff will end up getting deleted or not

"GERRY": well,see,whats the problem then?? you can stil smoke in your home,you can still smoke in public,outdoors,mostly now,and still be considerate of others.
hey,if you wanna kill yourself quicker with every puff,have fun!! I'm not here to judge you,just asking you not to take me with ya :)

Artful Dodger: LMAO :)))

Artful Dodger: hahahahaha.....variety is the spice of life..........

Charles Martel:   where else will people sit if there are no chairs?

Charles Martel: yep that also...

Only on  a politics board can a thread start about 911, morph into a discussion on smoking, and then change once again into comments about abortion, back to smoking,  and end with my dumb comment here. 

not to mention the damn butts on the ground everywhere

anastasia: and GERRY.................it is a filthy habit....not only does it ruin your lungs/health, but your clothes stink, your breath stinks and fingers that are nicotine stained aren't pretty....

and you SHOULDN'T smoke around anybody, anywhere.

anastasia: I will start collecting my old pension this year & i don't plan on being in any cribs,schools,or nursing homes. And i do respect others:))

"GERRY": im a smoker who is trying to quit
and i agree with the others when you walk past someone and get a nose full of there smoke
makes it very hard not to light one up yourself

anastasia: Well, that is what we get... a woman has a right to do with her body what she wishes.... but that we can understand that smoking effects more people than just the smoker, i wonder why we cant use the same logic with abortion???? The father has no rights, the unborn have no rights, its all about the woman, without regard to how her choices effect others.

"GERRY": Is it ok to smoke around babies in a crib? kids in school?? elderly that have breathing issues??

Czuch: no,I don't think that at all..

anastasia: you're effecting EVERYONE'S health around you...not just your own


What about abortions?????? You think that effects only the woman who has one?

anastasia: Why do our goverments allow people to grow weed & sell it to people who say they need it? THATS BIG TIME SMOKE:))